With J. Cole holding a worldwide listening session for his upcoming album Born Sinner (due out June 18) at specified locations around the globe tonight, we get to hear one of the LP's most anticipated collaborations. Cole links up with Kendrick on "Forbidden Fruit" which samples A Tribe Called Quest's 1993 classic, "Electric Relaxation." Ronnie Foster's "Mystic Brew." Pre-order the deluxe edition of Born Sinner on iTunes now.

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  • @themjali

    ehhhh

  • wow

    this album sounds verrrrry promising

  • j

    this is really regular but cool. Seems like a bonus cut.

  • HesusDuece

    disappointed there was no kendrick verse, but this shit was still dope

  • BITCHnoAdLib

    Beat is smooth, but it bumps at the same time. Not bad. Kendrick is excellent on that hook. My only complaint would have to be that Cole still relies on hashtag raps for a few bars, not a good look at all. Also, I hope that skit at the end is a one time thing and isn't representative of the rest of the album, because it might come off like he is ripping off Kendricks skit thingy from GKMC.
    Overalll, smooth, great song. I really can't hate on it at all.

    • Nononono

      No, not at all. Pre-iTunes a la carte single sales, most hip-hop albums had at least a few skits (Prince Paul, Fugees, Jay Z-Reasonable Doubt, Snoop's debut, UGK), so Cole definitely isn't ripping off Kendrick. Plus, Cole has national recognition before Kendrick with mixtapes and albums with skits or "speaking parts" included. Nah.

  • aHometown

    nahhh. i see what cole tryna do. the beats are great, but he's music doesnt seem to have the same emotion of the warm up. where are the thought provoking stories at??

  • LawdHammercY

    He has the audacity to sample that!, ...he delivers though. Shit sounds promising as hell right now.

  • MewLover34

    Not like I was hype for this album in the first place, but I really hope this isn't the best he has to offer from this record. Cole might be the most boring MC to ever obtain this level of praise. Maybe this song will be hella smooth in the context of the whole album, I hope it is, but on it's own? Not a song I will be playing many more times. #MegaFail at him mentioning his stupid Kanye marketing scheme too...

  • michael phelps

    Damn. I hope the KDot Cole Album sounds like this. Kendrick over Cole beats would smooth as fuck. Cole went in too god. you guys really don't like him huh?
    And he brought back Lil Cole! Hahahaha!!

  • neverbroke

    the track "born sinner" is out there too. best track from the album that i've heard so far

  • Tommytrillfigure

    Reminscent of overly dedicated even tho this is Coles track lol but born sinner is sounding like its going to hold its own come June 18th.

  • j

    nothing else sounds like this... you cant hate

  • Trey

    Having Kendrick only on the hook for Cole is like hearing Eminem only do a hook for Big Sean. Cole's talented but WAAAY too boring to hold my attention for more than 3 listens. What a letdown.

  • Complacent

    DAMN YA BOY SPRUNG A LEAK 8 TRACKS UP ALREADY....SMART MOVE BY COLE TO GO HEAD AND LEAK THE ALBUM NOW HE CAN MOVE HIS ALBUM UP WITHOUT LOOKING LIKE HE DODGING THE KANYE DATE

  • Kno

    "Electric Relaxation" is my favorite hip-hop track of all time. Don't think I can digest this for a while, and I like both artists.

  • CecilRhodez

    Listened to the whole album. Its good.

  • got that justin bieber

    yeah whole albums out.....

  • Devin

    dudes cool but he's boring as hell lmao

  • Chris Z

    not listening to the album til the 18th...but does anybody want to give a quick review? better than sideline story? less commercialized? etc

  • Devin

    He's like the opposite of Nas in fact good beats bur boring ass rapper

  • dagel

    goddamn i'm a big supporter of cole but i'm tired of everyone getting on tribe beats

    and yea i'm disappointed that kendrick isn't really on this proper

  • kingtut

    thats a GREAAT sample

  • Truthism

    anyone who didn't like this song or said it was boring is obviously a faggy Kendrick stan butthurt that he didn't have his own verse. Plain and simple

  • marty mcfly

    I appreciate the Tribe sample but though I wont say its wack, I cant say its that fire either. Shit is regular and please dont have Kendrick just do some simple shit on the hook cause its a waste of feature imo.

  • Jo

    Really wish Cole didn't sample as heavy as he does. If he wants to be a legend he's got to create something other people want to sample...

  • https://soundcloud.com/reachcloud9 cloud9

    @Jo, but sampling is the base of rap, think about it, most classic rap albums all contain heavy usage of samples.

  • http://fromthebayareawithlove.tumblr.com neto1093

    album leaked. Production has taken a huge step

  • few

    sampling has nothing to do with being a legend. what a silly thing to say

    anyway what's better born sinner or jesus piece? they seem to be in the same vain and of the same standard judging by early reviews

  • Smh

    BIAS ASS DOPES!

  • Real

    Cole won.

    Born Sinner >>>>

  • Boom!

    I am lowkey curious of a coupe of opinions of some people who heard the album. Please share! Lol I head "Let Nas Down" on rap genius. Nice lil story tellin there

  • Stop Lying To Yourself

    Yeezus is gonna kill "Born Sinner" and you motherfuckers know it LOL

    Don't get your hopes up!

  • a

    how did he reference dropping on the same day as yeezus if he changed the release date after it was finished

  • http://twitter.com/gtothefo GtotheFO

    I really thought Cole would pull a Drake and really come with it on the sophomore but it looks like this ones gonna be stale too. I miss the warm up.

    Funny though how all you'd see back then was Drake v. Cole and now it's changed to Kendrick.

  • pL

    I never listen to leaks but im not even tryna be excited about two albums on june 18. Ima download born sinner now so i can focus exclusively on yeezus the day it drops

  • Kadafi

    Good job Cole the album is nice, real nice. Haters gon hate

  • QQQQQ

    Album is dope as fuck

  • beyenesausage

    Lil Cole and Petey Pete (lil K.Dot) need a track together on that collab album

  • Industry Snitch

    Seriously dozed off 5 tracks in...and I like the dude but just can't hold my attention that Trouble has some fire production

  • http://www.2dopeboyz.com/2013/06/06/j-cole-forbidden-fruit-f-kendrick-lamar/ bryan

    so this song is about eating the pussy doe

  • 1hunnit

    That Villumnati track goes hard. For those looking for that "Hunger" you speak of.

  • Mt

    This nigga here. Mr. Marty McFaggot is a fucking hater. I would like to hear the ultimate rap song that meets that bitch nigga's standards.

  • Lawless_1

    I was more entertained by K.Dot's hooks than Cole's verses.

    Snooze.

  • zzzzzzZZZzzzzz…

    this album will be my baby's new bedtime lullaby when she needs to fall asleep.

  • Ha!

    'Villuminati' is fire and that 'Let Nas Down' joint is too nice ... about to listen to the leak for a 2nd time to really let it sink in and decide if its worth buying on the 18th.

  • mkd

    BORN SINNER HAS LEAKER

  • Don

    This album shits on his 1st, Proud of the nigga man.

  • THE TRUTH

    YEEZUS >>>>>>> MNIMN >>>>>>>> That other shit

  • marty mcfly

    @Mt, bitch go check the 2DBZ year end lists from the last couple years. Most of those albums meets my standard. Im actually not the hard on albums and honestly its really easy for me to find what I like about a project most times. This Born Sinner shit though? Other then the very first song I cant say its sounds that dope to me thus far and thats just honestly speaking. Dont be mad at me for what you hear on this nigga album.

  • killshake

    Fuck this is so shit.. never like this boring yawn cunt.. elevator music.

  • marty mcfly

    Im gonna give it about a week and see how I feel about it after some time has passed but my prediction is that Yeezus a probably get the win (artistically) between these two albums.

  • craig

    definitely can't flip that sample if you don't flip it as well or better than Tribe did and definitely can't put "ft. Kendrick Lamar" on there without a verse from him. Cole fucked up on this one but I don't expect kids who got into rap post-2000 to understand how big an L this song is

  • DX

    "Crooked Smile" is just way outta place doesn't fit with the rest of the songs like "Power Trip" does also I think it will be interesting to see which song he picks for a third single, if any.

  • KatoXV

    Album is a step up from Sideline Story but he aint about to kill the game with BornSinner... Its good, not great

  • K

    "The ghost of shake" ok real fucking clever mr underground

  • Idk

    soundcloud player >

  • that truth

    this is so much better than gkmc

  • 1hunnit

    So far its sounding better than Sideline Story, and that in itself is a success.

  • MusicHead

    Question How he did he know that he was going to drop the same day as Kanye, if this was already recorded ?

  • http://www.cashcrate.com/3370108 milly

    dammnnn niggas Doping this just based of the artists. kats aint even listening to the track nowadays. i did however and it was real fucking boring. cole needs to jump off these soft sampled shits

  • flo

    not even a Kendrick feature.. should of kept it off the credits... would make the album look better. but obviously Cole wants that out there, Kendrick hot and Cole falling behind. real talk.

  • http://insideravensmind.net nevarwilliams

    I like it and the album personally. Can't wait to see the comments about the OutKast sample lol

  • Ginzo

    This is hot, y'all schleeep.

  • slaughter

    Yo this shit is dope but, real talk, what the fuck is he thinking not having a Kendrick verse... would of made the song so much better

  • nosamyrag

    If you don't want to listen to the album till the official release date, why in the fuck would you want a review? Get the leak clown!

  • bob

    did the deluxe version leak yet?

  • MusicHead

    Land of the Snakes ......I wonder what y'all think about that ? Considering he used a OutKast sample.

  • POACMG

    Trouble is so sick.

  • For Damn Shame

    If you a J.Cole fan and is contemplating buying or downloading the album...

    Noooo @fans Don't do itttttttt

    ...seriously though. You'll be asking yourself "How does this nigga make NyQuil albums constantly?" and also "How do you progress this bad from being a potential legend?" The beats are nice but everything else is just...off

  • sharkbat3

    Couple unbiased comments about the album after first listen

    1) The production is crazy good.
    2) Lyrics are pretty sub-far. J. Cole is repetitive. Period.
    3) Let Nas Down single-handledly made the album worthwhile
    4) This is a very different look for Cole. Can't tell if I like or not but at least this was WAY better than Sideline Story...

  • shiningshadows

    What about J. Cole is boring? I've yet to see any reasoning behind that claim. Or is calling him boring still just the cool thing to do?

  • K1cK0r

    A Tribe Called Quest, one of the greats.

  • For Damn Shame

    @shiningshadows it's because he repeats himself, like seriously repeats. Not just content wise but actual lyrics. And it all started on his last album

  • MusicHead

    Aye for most of the majority of this album...Cole proves himself that he is capable of making NyQuil albums..it is definitely better than Come World...

    Doesn't have that many lame bars on here...he just spittin. which is coo.

    Repitive hooks at time..lack of creativity.

    The production is definitely hugely better than the 1st album & progressed beautifully .. Villuminati is a good intro but not much holds up or above that ..

    Overall ..good album a slight upgrade from Cole World..not great but definitely solid, very good. If this was the 1st album then ill def be pleased & ready for the 2nd album...will that being said.. Cole's 3rd album will be his best..there's def way more room to grow still...he gon get great for sure..he had very little but still moments showing potential..just gon take a lil longer than others.. This is off 1st listen with no songs actually sticking to me to want to repeat off bat besides Let Nas Down.. I will re-comment my opinion when I give this album time to grow on me.

  • DatGuy

    I think it's the beats.. The ones with pianos are very boring, "She Knows," "Crooked Smile," and "Sinner." The choir on that "Trouble" junt makes it very hard for me to listen to that song. All the other junts are straight to me. Cole has some nice flows and the lyrics are pretty decent. It just ain't nothing that really rides on the album even as much as that "Niggaz Know" song.. I'm just gonna take those four songs off though and made add some more from the Deluxe once I hear how thoe sound, but at this point, I'd give it an 8/10. So, yea, it ain't classic, but it's better than the debut, and progression is never a bad thing.

    But the third verse on "Runaway" >>>>>

  • DatGuy

    *"Born Sinner"

  • justenjoythisshit

    Finally, THIS is the Cole from The Warm Up.
    So dope!!

  • will

    1 - Villuminati - A+
    2 - skit
    3 - land of the snakes - C+
    4 - power trip - B+
    5 - interlude
    6 - trouble - D
    7 - runaway - C+
    8 - she knows - B
    9 - rich niggaz - B
    10 - skit
    11 - forbidden fruit - C
    12 - chaining day - F
    13 - ain't that some shit "interlude" - C+
    14 - crooked smile - B
    15 - let nas down - B
    16 -  born sinner - B

    Album - B

    best track is #1, couple low points in the middle, ups and downs but finishes strong. First listen, more likely than not it will grow on me.

    Copping it on release day still

  • jaghz

    6/10

  • Lawless_1

    Chaining Day is a dope track. I'm not sure what you listened to....

  • 2412

    1 – Villuminati – A+
    2 – skit
    3 – land of the snakes – B-
    4 – power trip – B+
    5 – Mo Money (interlude) A
    6 – trouble – B-
    7 – runaway – A-
    8 – she knows – C
    9 – rich niggaz – A
    10 – skit
    11 – forbidden fruit – B+
    12 – chaining day – B+
    13 – ain’t that some shit “interlude” – C+
    14 – crooked smile – B
    15 – let nas down – A
    16 - born sinner – B

  • 2412

    Overall dope album, def gonna grab it on the 18th.

  • marty mcfly

    @MusicHead, you being really nice with your album review. For real its always about what Cole's gonna do instead of what he doing right now. He puts out a song then people say well he's gonna come dope next time. Now after just hearing his new album you already talking about what he's gonna do with the next one. Lets be for real about this album, is it dope or not? Especially considering the amount of hype people been putting out there. Does this shit live up to your expectations or not? Honestly though, without stanning? Speaking of Nas, a very lyrical MC, you think Nas would rock with this shit or would he say Cole let him down again? Honestly? If he really had to keep it real? I mean I kinda listened to the album but I was doing other shit but I did listen all the way through it and the only thing that made me stop and really listen was the first song, the beginning of the 2nd song and a little bit of the Trouble song and the Nas song. All the other shit was like wtf is this nigga doing with this album for real. I might try to sit through this shit once or twice more but imo anybody giving this album a higher rating then 6/10 is being generous as fuck. Sometimes you just gotta keep it real.

  • Mikematic81

    First track sounds very much like Timbo drums...?
    Anybody can confirm ?

  • marty mcfly

    I give it a 4.5/10 at this point and time. Dont be mad at me just listen to the shit and give it an honest rating based on what you think is dope. Just saying

  • Fanta Beats

    check out my instrumental remake of J Cole - Forbidden Fruit f Kendrick Lamar prod by Fanta beats , let me know what you think guyz ;)

  • MusicHead

    @marty mcfly definitely agree with e try thing you said, I wasn't say Cole failed or let Nas down again but he def didnt make up for the 1st let down & wouldn't impress Nas, but it's able to be content with type of project.. like everything u said besides the intro, one other song & the Nas track...nothin else really stands out ...just kind of eh. & that Crooked Smile track is good but just does not fit in the sequencing of the album.. Like at all.. Especially with the skit in front of it..but nevertheless the album is still a upgrade from Sleepillmatic aka Cole World... My faves are the intro, runaway, forbidden fruit, let Nas down ..the others are average songs but they finish strong .. 7/10. Light 7/10 or strong 6/10. Once again I will comment about the album in a later post when the album grows on me. Ill be definitely waiting for your opinion as well Marty. Oh yea this album will def not be better than Ye's.

  • Black boy fly

    J.Cole flow is starting to get repetitive and boring now. This song with him and Kendrick is alright. Honestly when listening to this track I wanted the song to get back to the hook that's where this track shines.

  • marty mcfly

    @MusicHead, I hear what you saying but at this particular time I dont even have much of an opinion. Im just like wtf is going on with this album? I mean maybe he didnt let Nas down again LOL but something is definitely off here with this album. I dont know but oh well.

  • three

    for me, when new music comes out, especially somebody that draws as much attention as cole I listen to the music rather than judge. I listen to music to enjoy it, not to look for reasons not to. but hey thats just me.

  • idk

    I like to see people excited for music. which clearly people are since J Cole is trending on twitter off a damn leak LOL. but no matter if i think the music is good or not i like to hear that people enjoy somebodys' work. a lot of people on here try to act like they are too good for shit. its disappointing to see

  • Pauly D

    Cole really won with this album, holy fuck. From how greatly the music transitioned and flowed from one to another. To the production and exciting lyrics/different flows.

    Man this is great, especially Trouble on my first few listens.

    Buying 3 copies for sure!

  • Pauly D

    @Black boy fly

    His flow is getting repetative? Uhhh really? You think of "boring" when listening to songs like Trouble, Villuminati, Ain't That Some Shit, etc? Interastin

  • Pauly D

    @idk

    ikr. Some people (ahem) don't know how to be chill and just accept the music.

  • Pauly D

    Overall I give the album a 8.7/10. Yeezus will more than likely be better. And if it's not, that's cool too.

  • JS

    JUST HEARD BORN SINNER AND ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO A CLASSIC

    Yall over hyped this shit

  • GTFOHB

    ATCQ "ELECTRIC RELAXATION" IS BETTER THAN THIS AND IT'S 1993, STOP TRYING TO RECYCLE CLASSICS LIL PUNK

  • Complacent

    Is it safe to say Cole is eliminated from being the best album lol on June 18. At least I know I will be saving 15 dollars that day, might put it as a down payment on Madden 25.

  • moebetter

    cole album goin be fire ! Born Sinner june 18th goin be a cold summer

  • moebetter

    cole album goin be fire Born Sinner june 18th goin be a cold summer

  • http://twitter.com/nicholasnitro NITRO

    NI KENDRICK VERSE?????????? he would have killed this shit. i feel like cole did this on purpose

  • STINKMEANER

    THIS IS THE BEST COLE HAS EVER RAPPED

    I am listenin to LET NAS DOWN

    cole is spazzin on this album, BUY THIS ALBUM

  • Lol@cole

    Anybody who has the nerve to say this album is great needs to take Coles dick out their mouth. This nigga has so much to say but decides to say it in such a boring way. The beats chorus everything are so wack. People love to go against kanye so bad they'll elevate this trash to being on par with ye.

  • noratings

    ^^ word

  • Ani Khonsu

    DISAPPOINTMENT! U CAN'T SAY FEAT. K.DOT TO GENERATE A BUZZ THEN HE GET ON THE TRACK & NEVER SPIT A VERSE, SMH! DONT GO TIGALLO ON US KENDRICK, NOBODY GIVES A DAYM BOUT SIGNING A HOOK. WE NEED A VERSE PERIOD!!! PLZ MAKE UP FOR THIS ON A RMX

  • truth

    u hate on him, and he's fucking a bad bitch and making millions. cole wins you lose...forever.

  • KING

    1. Villuminati: B // Cole, we know you got signed by Hov and we know the story.
    2. Skit
    3. Land of the Snakes: B- // Song works with theme of the album. Sample is recycled.
    4. Power Trip: A // Radio song that works 100% better than Work Out. Dope.
    5. Interlude
    6. Trouble: C+ // Wicked fly beat and hook, subject matter is too repetitive.
    7. Runaway: A- // I fuck with it. The conscience Cole we all came here for.
    8. She Knows: A // I love these more upbeat tracks from Cole. Great chants in the back.
    9. Rich Niggaz: B+ // Great lyrics about the rappers in the industry. Real message.
    10. Skit
    11. Forbidden Fruit: A- // I dig this track a lot. Sample is dope. Intricate lyrics.
    12. Chaining Day: C- // Ehh, nothing special. Humble boasting at its finest.
    13. Interlude: D // Good thing its only an "interlude". Boring.
    14. Crooked Smile: A // This shit's dope. Good jam for the summer. Message shines.
    15. Let Nas Down: A // Best track that hasn't been pre-released.
    16. Born Sinner: B+ // Good closing track. Chill vibe.
    Overall: B- // I don't get it man, there are some tight tracks on here but overall, I'm gonna vibe to The Warm Up or FNL before this. Some tracks are forgettable but then again this is only my first listen. I'm gonna buy it to support Cole and hopefully some tracks are better with some listens.

  • KING

    Side Note: In terms of production, Cole improved a lot. Much better than Sideline Story.

  • Stop Being Bias!

    BORING!

    Talking about the whole album

  • Jules Winnfield

    Miss America was better than some of these tracks, he should left it on the album!

  • 1

    Some of y'all just would never let Cole win, no matter WHAT he does (*Marty McFly*)...

    My Opinion: Extremely dope album..and that No Money Interlude...shiiieeeettt

    Thank You J Cole for a dope Ass Lp!

    Next Up: Kanye:)

  • The Z

    How The Fuck did that nigga up there give "Chaining Day" a F???

    Fuck was you listenin to dog?

    Dope LP, defnitely not Boring.

    Well actually..if you a Molly Poppin Nigga (Woo!) ..everything below 130 BPM is probally boring to you.

  • formula

    Thought he was joking wen he said it this album comes from a dark place. Wot he forgot to mention was that it was also a crappy place. Wot is he Tryna achieve wid such substandard tracks? The height of mediocrity is this album. The outkast sample, wot injustice. Tears in ma eyes

  • ewr

    I thought the album was decent. ill give some songs a couple more listens

  • DatGuy

    I swear he told y'all there were no rap features.. Why y'all acting so surprised???

  • The Real TC

    I was really hopeful for this one, but the flip that he did on this is whack. I mean, 93 til infinity is my all time favorite beat and this doesn't touch it in the remotest. Definite Skip. Hope the rest tops it.

  • Cuervo

    Dope album with dope production. Rich niggaz is classic. Some of you niggas talking bad about the album was up at 5am downloading it, Y'all bigger fans than me

  • AyYyyy

    Born Sinner Review:

    1. Villuminati A- // This is vintage Cole, real hunger rap with good worldplay over an up tempo beat. I really like the strings too. Good way to start the album.
    2. Skit
    3. Land of Snakes C // Samples OutKasts 'Da. Art of Storytellin part 1' and fails. Essentially made the same beat over just not as good. Lyrically average, nothing special.
    4. Power Trip: A- // We've all heard it before, good choice for a single, great beat and feature.
    5. Mo Money Interlude C // Short interlude with looped synthy beat, not very impressive. Subject matter discusses how money rules everything.
    6. Trouble C // A decent song, decent beat and lyrics but Cole singings just sounds forced and not good.
    7. Runaway B- // Really nice beat, lyrics and concept but Cole singing the hook again is both hard to listen to and boring, kind of reminds me of Mos Def singing just not as good, lol.
    8. She Knows B- // Average beat and lyrics but Cole ONCE AGAIN tries to sing and IT DOESNT WORK. Tracks 6-8 in my opinion are all basically the same song.
    9. Rich Niggaz B // Nice beat and concept, altho I think the drums are a little weak. Vintage Cole rapping from both his and someone else's perspective.
    10. Skit
    11. Forbidden Fruit B+ // Uses same sample as Tribes Electric Relaxation but he makes his own and it works. Concept is good and lyrics also. I understand that he wanted to be the only rapper on the album but a Kendrick verse wouldve helped. Kendrick on the hook works good tho.
    12. Chaining Day B // Typical Cole sampled beat, reminds me of songs like 'Autograph'. Concept is cool, but repetitive in terms of discussing vanity and past Cole songs. Sings the hook again but doesn't sounds as bad. The beat switch and breakdown towards the end threw me off a little tho.
    13. Aint That Some shit (Interlude) D // Probably the worst track on the album. Really annoying beat IMO. Lyrics are really average and basically talks about nothing but fucking bitches.
    14. Crooked Smile A- // Another good single with a good message and feature.
    15. Let Nas Down B+ // This is the best 'storytelling' song on the album. Nice beat, production seems to be No I.D inspired and overall a good song.
    16. Born Sinner B // Just a really solid song. Nice cole beat with a good balance of drums synths and live instrumentation. The feature is nice too.

    Overall Im a bit disappointed with this album. In terms of lyrical content and subject matter there really was hardly and progression. I was anticipating a big improvement in production but for me it didn't really show. The middle of the album is kind of a drag but he picks it up towards the end. It does seem this time around Cole got his singles right! But as far as the rest of the album its really just pretty average. I consider myself a big J. Cole fan and was hoping for more but for me it came up short.

    6.5/10

  • Skittles4hoes

    Just read a Vibe review on Born Sinner and here's an excerpt from the review. "Interpolated with gospel choir cameos and playful skits (he even finds his own ad-lib!), the album seems to tear a page from good kid, m.A.A.d city by Kendrick Lamar." LLLAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMMEEEEEEEEEEEE. Show some originality Cole. This is the difference between him and K. Dot. Kendrick has tons of creativity and originality up his sleeve while Cole's sound just gets boring after a while. He's definitely talented he just needs to add some spice to his gumbo if you will. This sounds like he's completely emulating GKMC, i lose respect for him if this holds true.

  • 1

    @ Skittles4hoes

    you already formed your opinion about the Album off a Vibe Review and didn't even listen for yourself? Atleast thats what your last Sentence hints at...

    guess everybody's a music expert now-a-days...lol

  • Miso

    @Skittles4hoes I'm still listening to it, but it definitely only bears a slight, if any, resemblance to GKMC. I lose respect for you if you take Vibe reviews to heart tho. Js.

  • ear2ear

    First off, having an honest opinion is not hating.

    With that said, this album is just plain mediocre. And I'm not comparing him to Chief Keef or Waka, I'm comparing him to the artists that his fans have put him up there with purely based off hype. And I'll say it once again, J Cole crafts watered down versions of songs/sounds/themes we've already heard executed better by better artists. His album is stale. Flat. Just not feeling it much. Villuminati was nice though. I wish Jay-Z would put this much backing around Electronica. Cole had his two chances, now lets give (force) Electronica a shot to lead Roc Nation

  • 1

    Electronica didn't drop because of Electronica....he had enough hype, he had a release date, he had/has jay's co-sign..

    Him not dropping has nothing to do with Roc nation backing up J Cole, but rather Jay Electronica not really wanting to Drop it for whatever reason he may have...

    With that said..as far as I see it, J Cole's been handling a lot of the Promotion and Buzz building for his Album on his own..without getting a huge push from Roc Nation.

    Sure, Roc Nation is a defnitely a big help, but J Cole been doing a hell of a Job building a Buzz himself.

    Say what you want about J Cole, but in the Day and age of people like Trinidad James and 2 Chainz "representing" our culture, some of yall should really be thankful for Albums like these..(which doesn't mean you have to like it, but rather not always be dissing and downing cole for not making a timeless classic in your eyes)

  • marty mcfly

    ^^^ Yeah but Cole was put on to make dope music not to just benefit from super hype machines and then deliver weak product. Ima give you fools a real (honest) review of this album in a couple hours, smh. Stay Tuned

  • ear2ear

    @1 that's why I put "force" in parenthesis as in force Electronica to release music...because at this point Cole ain't delivering in terms artistry. Not saying he isn't grinding and hustling. His work ethic shits on Electronica's, and I'm glad hell probably do solid numbers... but after this album I would like to see what Electronica could offer rather than a third stale album from Cole.

  • Rizzle93

    Marty if you don't like it whatever but lots people do and from what i heard this is WAAAAAAAAAAY better than CWSS. So that's already a good sign.

  • marty mcfly

    @Rizzle93, You know what, im being 100% honest when I say I cant really say this album is better then Sideline Story. Now even though I didnt really like that album either on a lyrical level Sideline is better then this album. Im almost done with a what I think of this Born Sinner album.

  • 1

    @ that parenthesis slipped on me, my bad

    i feel you on the Jay Electronica shit... I honestly don't think he'll ever release that album because he just isn't into music like that anymore.

    As for Cole..i personally think the Album is dope..but thats cause I like exactly that kind of production and enjoyed the different flows and lyrics. I think the album is a grower, so a lot people might come to enjoy it as time passes.

    @ marty mcfly....I don't think anybody really wants to read your review because you've been so obviously biased since day 1.

    You're like the unfunny version of Bigghostface..

    Either you're just trolling all the time or you work for 2dopeboyz and just post your shit to keep the conversations going on this site....but do you homie, whatever gets you through the day

  • marty mcfly

    @ear2ear, I dont think Cole shits on Jay Elecs work ethic cause Jay Elec has about sixty something songs out there already but its just he probably doesn't know how to politic. @1 then dont read it but if you do, its not like im lying about the shit cause you hear this album so COMEONSON. Dont tell me you honestly think this shit is dope. Or THAT dope because no just no. Im not not gonna bash Cole to much im just gonna go track by track with the shit and tell you what you already hear. If you like it cool but for real hip hop heads I dont know how the fuck you would like this shit and thats just the truth.

  • Rizzle93

    @1 thank you. Marty never liked cole so idk why we would wanna read his "review". Cole fans KNOW this album ia better than Sideline story, lyrically and production wise, and even feature wise. Cole is "boring" to you because you've been over dosed with 2 chainz and lil wayne's hype club shit, this music has soul and groove.

  • Rizzle93

    @martymcfly real hip hop heads fuck with cole because he's one of the pioneer mainstream lyricists we have today. we need that shit.

  • marty mcfly

    @Rizzle93, Sideline Story had more conceptual lyricism and it just had a better vibe but thats just how I see it and yeah I guess real hip hop heads can fuck this but if Cole is the pioneer lyricists today then I think its a step down in lyricism for the culture. Now before you talk about my review, why dont you let me write it first cause at the end of the day you aint gotta agree with it.

  • marty mcfly

    Excuse, not a "better" vibe just had more balance in production...

  • marty mcfly

    And Cole is not boring to me because im somehow a club music head. Fool I just listened to Gangrene's Vodka & Ayahuasca and that album might not be as emotional as Cole's storys about all his relationships with girls but thats some real hip hop shit to me fam. This is some watered down shit thats just been marketed as the real shit.

  • http://N/A XI

    This hook >

  • http://N/A XI

    This is some watered down shit thats just been MARKETED as the real shit.

    marty mcfly said this on June 7th, 2013 at 3:58 pm

    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
    THIS, though.

  • For Damn Shame

    Smh it really REALLY saddens me that Cole was suppose to be like the leader of the new school and now people are STILL waiting for him to tap his full potential...it's like Drake's "Thank Me Later" wasn't a great album but man he delivered on "Take Care". Kendrick was killing shit with "O.D." but "Section 80" and "GKMC" showed us he isn't afraid to try different AND isn't afraid of the crown he gonna get..but it's like Cole WANTS to stay mediocre, like if this was XV's album I'll be like "Okay, okay XV getting better." but when a nigga like Cole takes the title of next king and gives his fanbase two "meh's" in a row, you gotta ask yourself who is around this nigga saying this stuff is classic or even great? It's like watching a nigga get drafted with the 2md pick and 4 years later niggas STILL waiting for his potential to come out while Drake is LeBroning the game and Kendrick is becoming like D-Rose or even a young Kobe. J.Cole really needs to study music albums or something cause I can't believe the same nigga that made "The Warm Up" and "FNL" made "CW:SS" and "Born Sinner"...it's like homie wants to average 12 pts, 3 rebs and 4 assists for the rest of his career.

  • THCS

    I just keep expecting Phife's voice to come on.

    "I like 'em brown, yellow, Puerto Rican or Haitian
    Name is Phife Dawg from the Zulu Nation"

  • swade

    Pretty much exactly what For Damn Shame said

  • Girl loves hip hop

    There was a flaw with the repetitive subject matter in the middle, I could do with out she know and trouble, and chorus of land of the snakes. By any means though Great album. Great singles. The warm up is still his greatest work thus far but Born Sinner does not disappoint. Haven't heard the bonus tracks yet which would probably boost my rating up. But a fair 8/10 well deserved.

  • DISNIQQA

    Completely agree with For Damn Shame. Like after watching alot of interviews It seemed like Cole was saying he was being pressured by the label and by himself to make a good first album so he sacrificed some creativity and didnt neccessarily sell out but made a watered down record. Which is cool, I get that.

    So for Born Sinner I was like 'Ight hell yeah hes gunna go back to making some real good hip hop shit and good ass songs like FNL and The Warm Up' but after listening a couple times thru im still disappointed. I love his music but HE CANT SING FOR SHIT. Like why is he trying to sing on so many tracks? Even compared to Sideline Story there were a lot of watered down songs (Cole World, In the Morning, Workout) but there he made up for that with really good tracks (DAAD3, Lost Ones, Never Told, Nobodys Perfect, Rise and Shine Gods Gift). Born Sinner for me is full of more mediocre songs than really good ones and it really just dissapoints me.

  • Girl loves hip hop

    I'm trying I'm really trying to see what you guys see. See the boringness, see the mediocrity in his lyrics, see his gimic, his boring dry persona. But I don't. I see talent, I see spark, I see a rapper with a talent. Though I would have preferred more story telling cause thats his zone I'm not against the route he chose because now I have new favorites. To be honest. Gkmc wasn't what yal maKing it seem. But I don't wanna knock another great artist down toprove Yal wrong. Of course I expected a 20/10 cause that's how much of a fan I am. But I'll take this album with pride n joy because it's great, replayable, and knocks the shit out of slide line story.

  • ear2ear

    I agree about Jay Elect @marty. Hope we someday see what the album will be like bc I have all his other discography and think there's a lot of promise. We shall see. He might have two features on the 18th one on Mac Millers album, and rumored one on Kanye's so hopefully that gives him some momentum.

  • marty mcfly

    Ok here we fucking go. Let me start by saying these are just MY opinions so if you dont agree thats fine. This is NOT an attempt to just bash Cole or to try and be funny because then you wouldn't even really see the point in what im saying at all. I would've loved to hear this album and come back and say damn this shit is incredible but that just didnt happen. Also if your a Cole stan, you hear things different because you like Cole alot already and thats fine but im coming from the perspective of just hearing the album twice and you might have listened 4 or 5 times already but with that being said, here goes. We all know what we're here for people and thats dope beats and dope rhymes PERIOD so lets go through this album shall we...

    Villuminati - Now at this point im hearing the beat and thinking YEAH !!! Hip hop is in the building then he starts out with a negative connotation because he says "sometimes I brag like Hov" and then follows that with the BIG sample "born sinner, the opposite of a winner" Also later on this album somewhere I heard Cole say something about how a billionaire would laugh and Jayz cash? Now I get it, and I dont think Cole would disrespect Jay but dont send shots at somebody the changed your life for the better just so you can seem better then or more holy then. OK now the beat is dope but the lyricism is kinda all over the place and he's rapping about getting back his soul and how he's never gonna let it go again. Now I can get deep with that a speak on the pros and cons of this kinda record but the good outweighs the bad so I'll just say its Dope.

    Land of the Snakes - Again I hear the beat and I think ok he got a little Outkast in him, thats cool, (but having a dope sample dont just automatically mean the shit is dope. Its about what you do with the sample) and the title is Land Of The Snakes so im like shit, he bout to go in on a few people now. Then I get through the first verse and im like thats cool and then this nigga comes with some "girl make that ass drop" on the hook and im like NO!!! No just NO. As a hip hop head trust me, we dont wanna hear no formulaic type bullshit especially on the 2nd damn song. Then he starts talking about bitches and all his relationship ups and downs and thats cool and all but I thought this nigga said his album was gonna be on some dark shit and just overall real shit. Now some of what he says does have thoughtfulness behind it but not much and again a dope sample cant always save the song. So I give this song a meh... Its aiiiight I guess but not that dope.

    Power Trip - Commercial watered down wack shit PERIOD

    Mo Money - The beat is wack and the concept has been done before and better (Sticky Fingaz - Money Talks, The Game - Money) but thats not what makes this song wack, but why the fuck would you have one verse and then fade out especially so early in the album? Is there a full version? idk but this song aint that dope, its the opposite. Wack

    Trouble - Now I hear people saying the beat is dope but to me its just aiight. Go listen to Game's Hallelujah if you wanna hear a dope track on some church shit, (Jesus Piece is better then Born Sinner). He goes back to talking about bitches this and hoes of course but its like damn man, give me some real shit not no shit about how bitches make you feel like you in trouble, is this nigga fucking serious? FOH. Wack

    Runaway - This should've been the first song on the album you hear about bitches cause for hip hop heads usually those are the fillers, but anyway he talking about bitches and hoes again and then this nigga is singing the fucking hook again. Like nigga stop singing the fucking hooks for real fool, Cole is not Drake so stop that shit. Now he does say some real shit about relationships and how men should treat they girl and I can agree with that but at this point this album is getting boring. Cant say its wack but it aint that dope either.

    She Knows - Watered down wack shit. Cole back on his talking about bitches and he back singing again. The beat is garbage and the song is trash PERIOD

    Rich Niggaz - He starts the track with a fucking harp on some soft shit and then he comes in saying "I hate rich niggaz" but yet he is one himself. Now to be fair the message behind this song is a good one. Too many niggas get money and then somehow start acting different when its like homie dont let the money change you because just as fast as it came it can go. So I appreciate the message but the execution could've been better. I'll give it a DOPE but it barely meets that bar cause that fucking harp is killin me.

    Forbidden Fruit - Like the sample but I dont like the song. The hook is corny as shit and the beat could've been given to someone like Joey Bada$$ who would've came with better content cause you know Cole is back on his raps about bitches here again too. Smh, this nigga is like the kid in high school that finally gets some pussy and then for the rest of the year he talking about bitches this and bitches that. Man somebody give this nigga some more range in subject matter. Shit is not dope and its very very close to being wack.

    Chaining Day - This song also deals with people that have alot of money but make bad decisions but he already covered this topic on Villuminati, Mo Money and Rich Niggaz and the nigga singing again smh. The beat is on some R&B during christmas time shit. FOH. He back to talking about how he's rich and you other bitches and niggas are broke and the shit is fucking boring. The nigga does some chopped and screwed shit at the end while he's talking about how he chain buying crazy. Fucking Wack

    Aint That Some Shit - WACK PERIOD and at this point I want to stop listening to this album because its starting to overflow with wackness.

    Crooked Smile - its aiight

    Let Nas Down - This the best song on the album but for all my hip hop heads out there, look at the premise of this song "Let Nas Down" Now this aint me saying it, its Cole saying it out his own mouth. He also has a line in the hook about No I.D and im thinking why you aint let that nigga produce your album Cole? Just saying and I get what he's saying on the record but people have to stop with this belief that you gotta water down your craft to get to a mainstream level. No you dont and Cole sends shots at the label and yada yada but just stop it. Who also takes responsibility for his wack records and that would make a person think he would stop making them but on Born Sinner the wackness continues.

    Born Sinner - Its aiight but at this point i've come to the conclusion that the album aint that dope.

    The good news for all you sinners out there is Yeezus is on the way. Yes lord Hallelujah !!! You sinners can be born again and purified by some real hip hop as long as you believe in Yeezus LOL. Dont be mad at me but I gotta keep it real. Born Sinner is just not that dope end of fucking story (Its almost just wack period). Also get Statik Selectah's album and Mac Millers album now have a nice day.

  • For Damn Shame

    @Girlloveshiphop what you need to understand is nobody saw GKMC coming. We all knew Kendrick had mass talent (whole TDE in fact) but the nigga had a story of a good kid in a mad city..literally. Like you need to understand the artistic look of it. He's young and only worried about fuckin', getting money and chilling with his niggas but as the story progresses he's coming of age and reaching manhood within the dark side of the events. Idk what you listened to on GKMC but it was the most cohesive concept album in about 5 years if not more. The fucked up part is Cole was literally suppose to be what Kendrick is right now lol aka the "anti-Drake" but not a negative way but where Drake is gonna make pop singles while making great songs in general, Kendrick makes street related stuff that we vibe to. It's like a best of both worlds effect. Also I don't understand something...if Drake dropped Take Care and it was worse than Comeback Season niggas would say he's done but when Cole drops two albums that even his fans are saying is "Not better than FNL or Warm Up" niggas don't see a problem with that. Like yall shouldn't be saying "LeBron was better in high school but he's still cool in the pros." Naw, not when niggas suppose to progress...like his production obviously improved but his mind didn't. I mean he even said he's Durant because if LeBron (Drake) wasn't there he would be the best, NO COLE! Niggas wanted you to be the best but it failed and he just don't see that. Niggas don't underrate Cole, he just underwhelms fans.

  • Joel

    @Marty....I think that review is a little harsh haha...you can't honestly believe that you gave him a fair shake with that shit

  • Joel

    I agree with you...the album is underwhelming...I'm not sure that I would say it's better than sideline story either honestly..but hardly wack...lets be consistent with our language and not speak in hyperbole...if this album is wack then how do we describe all the other stuff coming out that is obviously way worse....I know we're arguing semantics here, I just don't like when people are overly negative in their reactions to overhyped albums (which happens alot with mainstream hip hop in particular) because we lose sight of the fact that its still a considerably large step up from alot of the garbage being marketed as hip hop these days....

  • For Damn Shame

    And please believe me, Cole was probably my most favorite rapper at the time in high school. Like a nigga would listen to Warm Up and FNL and then tell people to download that shit ASAP. Cole reminds me of Evan Turner cause back in college Evan would turn shit up but soon as he got to the league he just fell off. I don't want that for Cole but if a nigga moves his date to battle Kanye and makes it seem like it's the best shit we gonna hear and releases this...naw nigga.

  • Ayyy

    @marty mcfly "Smh, this nigga is like the kid in high school that finally gets some pussy and then for the rest of the year he talking about bitches this and bitches that."

    LMAOOO, I was dying at this

  • For Damn Shame

    @Joel see that's the thing...niggas shouldn't bring in other wack rapper's albums. This is COLE's album. Judge him on him not wack rapper's shit cause that adds undeserved points to his stuff...if those rappers were signed to Hov then was on the album and was named a new leader then it's cool but if not, don't compare superstars to role players.

  • Girl loves hip hop

    @fordamnshame first of all the story with the skits is the only reason gkmc is above standard. But take the album apart. Play a friend a song to put them on some real music You can't just choose any song from the album. Truthfully there's only 4 Songs I replay today. The other songs fit with the story. No stand out tracks. Everyone has their best, nothing kanye has made is better than College Dropout. IMO. But back to the artist at hand. J. Cole. Only 2 songs are replaceable In which he could have put in a cool story telling bit which is his zone. Born Sinner is better than his debut therefore a profession

  • ish

    KENDRICK WOULDVE BODIED JCOLE and i think he Probably KNEW THAT thats why he aint let him spit like honestly you put kendrick Lamar ON your album and dont let him spit a verse WTF /outside of POWERTRIP which ive heard a million times by now Crooked smile, VILLUMINATI & Chaining day COLE completely let me down man not Even close to sideline story & he set himself up sampling such classic songs from Outkast & Tribe FAIL dropping on the same day as YEEZY and u not even bringing no HEAT WTF JCOLE SMDH THIS ALBUM IS MAD BORING DREAMVILLE 4REAL CUZ THIS SHIT PUT A NIGGA TO SLEEP zzzzzz.WALE ALBUM gon be better than this didnt think that would happen smh YEEZUS SAVE US

  • For Damn Shame

    @girlloveshiphop whoooaahhh....lol uhhh. I don't whether to laugh or to feel weird because me and my friends actually did that months ago for the hell of it..and it was still great. Sing About Me/Dying of Thirst, Real, Don't Kill My Vibe, Swimming Pools, Backseat Freestyle, Peer Pressure, Compton, m.a.a.d city (even though Mercy took the appeal of the beat away), Money Trees (fuckin' classic..seriously) were all great songs when the skits are taken away with (imo) good kid not being that good. And idk if you're serious but you can easily replace Born Sinner songs with his others. I mean it's you're opinion so it's okay but seriously GKMC w/o the skits is still great..

  • For Damn Shame

    Btw i couldn't even speak on Sherane cause it's the story line basically so back then I didn't even add that song into discussion.

  • Joel

    @for damn shame the fact that he pushed the album back 6 months and hyped it so much...then proceeds to drop an average album does make him look like a chump...yes I agree...but like I said before the album isn't wack...just disappointing....

    words have different meanings to different people....to me an album is wack if it has very few if any redeeming qualities....which is not the case for this album...for me atleast....I took issue with the word...as far as being disappointed im right there with both you and Marty...

    in Cole's defense I will say this....I think he will continue to be haunted by the high quality of his mixtapes....the warm up IMO is possibly the best rap mixtape that's been released in the last 10 years....and friday night lights is not far behind....living up to that is extremely difficult in a culture that believes in infinite progress...sometimes artists plateau and level off....you don't need to disparage them for it...just readjust your expectations..he doesn't have to be a savior to the game...just a pretty good producer/average MC..to me Cole is firmly a 2nd tier rapper right now...his flow is repetitive and his lyricism is uninspired and boring....I do think that his production was consistently better across all songs on this album....though when comparing the best songs between this and sideline story there is not that much of a difference

  • Girl loves hip hop

    Nah. Beg to differ

  • QBN

    OK I'm seeing mixed reviews.. I don't hate on Cole, but I'm not hyped to listen to him. His last album was weak, he's good but I don't think he makes music that really stands out. Something's missing..

  • PraiseRZA

    This post alone is 813 dope 63 nope at the moment. Who here gets that kind of ratio outside of k.dot? Clearly the case of a VERY vocal minority here that want to claim superiority by trolling on a dope-ass album. If ASAP was sampling ATCQ, the 63 of you would think it was the most mind-blowing shit ever.

    Fact is, Cole isn't the hypebeast darling anymore because hip hop is in a different place than it was in 2010. In a post-Dark Twisted Fantasy world, the tastemakers in hip-hop praise STYLE over SUBSTANCE - which is not Cole's lane. At the end of the day, this record is the hard work of a relatable dude who struggles with real life problems; the whole concept is about living in a balance - not unlike GKMC. You aren't going to find gimmicks here, or a guy who will name drop 18 designers. Born Sinner isn't "coming out of nowhere" and it's not a genre-bending space odyssey. But if you stop worrying about what's cool at the moment and sit down to really listen through this album, I have a hard time believing that you won't find something that strikes a chord.

    Chill out and enjoy a great album. Nice work, Jermaine.

  • Exhibit C

    @PraiseRZA

    One of the few good, balanced comments i've ever read on this site. Co-sign.

  • marty mcfly

    @ Joel, sometimes you just cant make an excuse for shit. This is not about Cole's mixtapes, its not about his passed, Its not about what Kendrick does or what Drake does or what anybody else does. ITS ABOUT THIS ALBUM STRAIGHT UP AND DOWN. Now is the album FIRE period. Is this album incredible hip hop music, rhymes and beats and straight about fire dope shit? Thats all people are concerned with, Its Cole period. You say Cole's album is this and that compared to other albums but I could say the same thing, that other albums compared to Born Sinner is way better but I dont need to do that cause its about Cole. Sometimes artists dont make dope albums, thats just how the game goes.

  • MewLover34

    @Marty you were far too kind to this bullshit. Not a single song on this album I will be bumping in the future, and as a whole it is about as boring as it gets. The people hyping it up will never ever admit it, but this is about as big a disappointment as you could of imagined when people were speculating about the Cole/Kanye albums. Least Ye will be out in 10 days and we can forget this "competition" ever happened. Ye's album is already better btw, as we have already heard two awesome songs...

  • Joel

    you can't judge an album off of its dope to nope ratio....that's just silly...it reflects the preferences of people who frequent the site and says nothing at all about the aesthetic value of the music in question...I read somewhere in one of the comment threads that 90% of people just click nope immediately on any song with lil wayne in the title without listening to the song...probably because most of the people on this site think he is a clown....in fact if you did a search by artist and clicked through their stuff I'm willing to bet that the dope:nope ratio would be fairly consistent regardless of the song quality

  • marty mcfly

    Cole is not the only rapper who's "relatable" or raps with substance in hip hop so people need to get off that and honestly its alot of MCs that have more subject matter and more substance then J Cole so please stop. Cole revisits the same topics ALOT, that doesn't make him more relatable and on top of that he spends alot of time talking about dealing with being famous and most of you cant relate to that so just stop. #Keep it fucking real.

  • marty mcfly

    @MewLover34, WORD, Its like dude you think I wanted to give a review like that? No I didnt. If people remember back about a year and a half ago, I said some early songs from SlaughterHouse wasn't that dope. Then as soon as they dropped the EP, I said hold up, I underestimated these guys cause this shit is FIRE. I would've loved to say Born Sinner is straight up FIRE but after I listened to the album I just couldn't honestly say that. I tried to be fair with my review but when I say the shit wasn't dope, it just wasn't. I mean, I cant just front like its that dope shit when its not.

  • Joel

    @Marty...

    well I certainly would never call Born Sinner dope....or really any of the adjectives you just used...so I'm not sure if you're actually contesting what I said or not...for me the album is pretty average..but not an absolute flop as you and others seem to be suggesting....perhaps my expectations for him were lower than yours

    personally I don't know why everyone is getting all hyped about this Ye vs. Cole thing anyway....Action Bronson joint that comes out next week is going to be fire... and all the commentators on this site are sleeping on it comparing Cole, Kanye and Mac miller

  • PraiseRZA

    i would say that this is the best rap album since GKMC. just curious, and i know this is subjective, but for those who are less impressed, which album in that span was better than born sinner?

  • MewLover34

    Yeah I assume that Bronson EP will be better than this, will certainly have better production. That, to me is the most disappointing part of this record, the production is sooo weak. Most of the songs sound exactly the same (with the same content over them too). I was expecting a big step up in the beats on this thing, and I can't prove it yet, but I think we all know the production will be miles ahead of this on the Ye album, and the Drake album later this summer.

  • Joel

    The Doppelgangaz "Hark" and Illogic and Blockhead "Capture the Sun"

    off the top of my head...

  • MewLover34

    @PraiseRZA, A$AP Rocky & Aesop Rock off the top of my head

  • PraiseRZA

    that's fair, but conjecture aside, i'm asking which album since GKMC was better?

  • MewLover34

    And Tyler's Wolf of course

  • PraiseRZA

    sorry - i was late there - what about ASAP did you prefer? Aesop was before GKMC i believe.

  • PraiseRZA

    this is just me, but i think that ASAP's subject matter and lines aren't any more original than coles, and the same with wolf. i would guess that most people could describe either's lyrical/conceptual wheelhouse in a couple of words.

  • MewLover34

    A$AP Rocky - Long.Live.A$AP, Aesop Rock & Kimya Dawson - Hokey Fright, Tyler The Creator - Wolf, Chance The Rapper - Acid Rap, Pro Era - Peep The Aprocalypse, The Underachievers - Indigoism, Ghostface - 12 Reasons to Die

  • Joel

    Qwel and Maker "Beautiful Raw" was fucking phenomenal...

    its like comparing apples to oranges though...underground artists that aren't under huge pressure to sell albums can take more creative risks...that's why its so difficult for a mainstream artist to make an album that both hip hop heads and casual music listeners will both laud....Kendrick pulled it off with Good Kid Mad City and in that regard it would be more appropriate to compare him with Kanye than Cole

  • Joel

    okay...Hokey fright was like a freakshow science experiment gone awry....I find it hard to believe that anyone would rate that above Born Sinner....not sure I'd put Wolf or Long Live A$AP above it either...but I agree with the rest...

  • duh

    Love live asap was fucking garbage. He dropped an outstanding mixtape and his album was trash. Skrillex? yeah ok.

  • MewLover34

    I would rate Hokey Fright at least an 8, closer to a 9. This? a 5 is generous.

  • MewLover34

    If you thought the A$AP mixtape was "outstanding", the album was the exact same shit, so you should have loved it. And Skrillex is dope, people collaborate across genres all the time, sorry it was an electronic cat and not some rock dude, but it was a good song.

  • marty mcfly

    @ Joel, yeah but again this aint about Action Bronson or Kendrick or anybody else. THIS c section is about J COLE and nobody says Oh shit this album was pretty average. Like niggas dont wanna hear no average shit, people wanna hear above average especially from somebody who they say is this like Cole. Imo this aint even average, this is below average and the bar of excellence is not set on average in hip hop. If its average then dont come out with the shit because fuck average.

  • Joel

    @MewLover34.... that really surprises me....I found it difficult to even listen to...I really wanted to like it too....huge Aesop fan....but I don't think those two work together at all....I understand she's in the anti-folk genre but her songwriting is simple to the point of being insulting...and I don't think Aesop really brought his best stuff either

    I think I have liked every album he drops since Labor Days less and less....he needs to reunite with blockhead and make another album like float...that would be so ill

  • marty mcfly

    You already wanna talk about other niggas albums and mixtapes just a few hours after hearing one of the most anticipated and hyped up albums of the year thus far and thats because the shit was a disappointment.

  • MewLover34

    @Joel, if you don't like her, then it is going to be hard to get into the album that much. I do, so I loved it, and I think they work incredibly well together. That record has some of Aesop's best stuff on it.

    And co-sign Marty, The album is average at best, and that is certainly nothing to get excited about, let alone say for three weeks the album is going to be better than one from a man who a track record as strong as Ye.

  • marty mcfly

    I mean talk about BORN SINNER, if you think its dope then say that and if you think its fucking wack then say that but keep this shit on Cole cause there will always be other albums to compare to.

  • Joel

    @ Marty...calm yourself bro...you seem angry at the world or something...J Cole doesn't owe you or anyone else shit...he hyped up his album like it was gonna be a classic and failed...end of story...you have no idea what his intention was or how much or little effort went into crafting the final product so why you wanna crucify him for not meeting your high standards?...what's wrong with calling it what it is and saying its average? (or below average if you will)...the way your acting you'd think he disrespected your mom or something...take a chill pill bro

  • MewLover34

    @Marty, kk back on track, Born Sinner sucks...

  • marty mcfly

    I wanna know for real because people always change the subject on this nigga Cole when they cant say his shit is dope. If my opinion about these songs is wrong then whats your opinion on these songs? Rhyme for Rhyme and beat for beat? I'll get at ya'll later but damn stop with the excuses and the being nice.Do you think this shit is DOPE or WACK? All the in the middle shit is average and like I said, fuck being average. Im out this bitch. One

  • MewLover34

    Fuck it, I want to talk about Wolf. Rusty was an amazing song, and Domo actually had a dope verse.

  • marty mcfly

    @ Joel, its not about you challenging my opinion its about your opinion. If you think its dope then say that and if you think its average then say that but dont tell me I cant think its below average because at least I went through the shit song for song to explain why I feel the way I do. You didnt do that, you just saying its this and that and talking about my opinion. Talk about your opinion not mine.

  • Joel

    @Marty...I find it extremely difficult to engage you in conversation...I have been talking about the album this entire time and have already stated that I thought it was a disappointment multiple times..I think you just enjoy being confrontational..we are basically in full agreement on the quality of the album...I just thought you were being extreme to call it wack....that's all....why you seem to believe that an album can either be dope or wack and nothing inbetween is beyond me

  • duh

    I thought cole was overrated from the jump to be honest... his flow and rhymes never were the reason he stood out, it was more of his story telling and his content. He is a alightly above average rapper with very relatable songs. Thats basically the jist of it

  • Joel

    that's how conversations work....you comment on what other people say...back and forth...and hopefully something interesting is created in the exchange...you just seem like you are looking for a fight

  • Joel

    duh said......"I thought cole was overrated from the jump to be honest… his flow and rhymes never were the reason he stood out, it was more of his story telling and his content. He is a alightly above average rapper with very relatable songs. Thats basically the jist of it"

    ^
    this

    and I would also add that his throwback production on his mixtapes was appealing

  • Pauly D

    "I thought cole was overrated from the jump to be honest… his flow and rhymes never were the reason he stood out, it was more of his story telling and his content. He is a alightly above average rapper with very relatable songs. Thats basically the jist of it"

    Hell no. Everyone wants to throw out the word "overrated" wheneverthey don't like something. Nigga, if you don't like something just say it and stop BSing around, like Marty said.

  • For Damn Shame

    @marty my god..i couldn't of said it better. Once you start to compare, the shit ain't that good to begin with.

  • Pauly D

    I don't like Schoolboy Q very much. Is he overrated and have a lack of talent because I don't like his music? Hardly. See how that works?

  • Pauly D

    So yeah, I've been listening to this album all day and it gets better with each listen.

    Cole's production has improved. The subjects on here are great, especially the relation to the seven deadly sins and Cole's adaption to his fame. I think Billboard pretty much sums up my feelings:

    "Perhaps inspired by his release-date rival, Kanye West, J. Cole has learned how to make an entrance.

    Last night (June 6), in a more intimate, high-tech version of the premiere of Yeezy's "New Slaves" — which was shown via projector in public spaces in 66 cities worldwide — J. Cole hosted a simultaneous, international listening party for his sophomore album, "Born Sinner," at eight venues in the U.S., Canada and Britain. At the invite-only events (in New York City, Atlanta, Houston, Chicago, L.A., London, Toronto and his hometown of Fayetteville, N.C.), lucky attendees streamed the anticipated album, out June 18 via Roc Nation/Columbia, on their smartphones and tablets via the LISNR app. The rapper-producer has kept the album extremely close to his chest, so this is the first time "Born Sinner" has been played for a wider audience.

    J. Cole: The Billboard Cover Story

    At the NYC listening session, a few hundred fans, press and assorted VIPs packed into NYC's SVA Theater in Chelsea, where Beats by Dre headphones were distributed for the ears and cartons of fancy flavored popcorn for the stomach. With so many rappers claiming their music is "motion-picture shit," it was a nice flourish. Wifi, on the "Born Sinner" network, of course, was provided for streaming via LISNR, but not everything went smoothly. Before the listening, when LISNR reps asked if anyone was having any issues, dozens of hands set up. An amped-up kid who kept yelling out "Born Sinner Platinum" looked particularly miffed.

    J. Cole stepped on stage and explained why he chose to unveil the album this way, comparing the event to the usual listening party. "When the songs are playing I don't want you talking about them. I want you listening to every word," he said. "I want everyone in their own world."

    When the stream finally began, some in the crowd weren't able to get LISNR working at all. (Switching from Wifi to 4G, a non-intuitive move to be sure, worked for us). The experience lost more of its impact when the album leaked online hours after. Maybe the old-fashioned listening party isn't so bad after all.

    Still, the complaints couldn't stifle the real takeaway of the night: "Born Sinner" was stellar, and a big step up from Cole's previous work. Tech problems be damned, the listening was still a unique experience with hundreds of music lovers around the world bobbing their heads to the same music at the same time. Including Cole, who sat to the side of the theater and listened along intently just like everybody else. On the screen, a mash-up of religious imagery flashed by — snakes, devils, tortured souls, angels, clouds — transitioning from red and black to bright white as the album played on. It represented the album's journey, from dark to light, from heaven to hell, as Cole himself explained at the listening event. The imagery was a nice touch, but in the end not necessary. "Born Sinner," easily the best hip-hop album of 2013 so far, stands on its own merits.

    1. "Villuminati"
    The opening track is a well-aimed warning shot. Over a backdrop of dramatic, rising strings, Notorious B.I.G. samples ("Juicy") and a live choir — a sonic theme of the album — the first words Cole utters are an adlib: "It's way darker this time." Spoiler: The rest of the album definitely lives up to that. But Cole is also more confident than ever. "Sometimes I brag like Hov," he raps, before taking a comedic shot at Trinidad James: "My pops was club-hopping back when clubbing Rick James was out and all I get is Trinidad." There's an unfortunate group of lighthearted lines that uses a homophobic slur repeatedly.

    2. "Kerney Sermon (Skit)" —3. "Land of the Snakes"
    After a brief skit featuring a pastor giving a sermon ("Kerney Sermon"), Cole launches into "Land of the Snakes," which samples the bittersweet, descending synths of 1998 Outkast classic "The Art of Storytelling Pt. 1." He reminisces on his humble Fayetteville upbringings, his move up north, and above all, his struggle with temptation. "I came out the womb with my dick hard," he raps. The song breaks down at the end, the synths warbling and filtering out as the drums drop to sparse percussion. It's another sign of Cole's big step up production-wise, already evident two songs in. (Cole produced every track on the album aside from the two interludes.)

    4. "Power Trip" feat. Miguel
    Yes, we've all heard it plenty of times by now (it's currently at No. 11 on the Hot 100), but Cole's hit single "Power Trip" still sounds as good as ever in the context of the album. And it successfully introduced many of the sonic elements that tie "Born Sinner" together: crunchy, jumpy Timbaland-inspired drums, deep, rumbling bass, and soulful melodies, often sung by Cole himself — though Miguel provides a huge assist here, of course.

    5. "Mo Money (Interlude)"
    Don't believe the parenthetical in the song title. This is a real song, albeit, a relatively brief one. While eerie theremin sounds intertwine, Cole raps about greenbacks, skillfully ending each line with money. It's one of the most quotable verses on the album, and will be an inevitable street favorite.

    6. "Trouble"
    One of the darkest songs on the album, "Trouble" again features a choir, but this time Cole really has them go off. They handle the hook, break down into "oohs" and "aahs," and belt out solo riffs throughout. It's big, powerful, and another quantum leap forward for Cole's beatmaking. Lyrically, he's again addressing temptation, in a possible riff off Trinidad James' "All Gold Everything": "Liquor all on my breath, bitches all in my sight."

    7. "Runaway"
    On the lush "Runaway," Cole talks about his relationship troubles, which, underneath the moral struggles and spiritual dichotomies hinted at by the album title, is another topic he goes back to throughout the record. He's trying to be good to his girl but isn't succeeding: "You don't wanna let her down but you're too young for the settle down." But the topics soon expand: a pervy high school coach, how rape during slavery led to his grandmother's light complexion. The drama builds musically as well, with breakbeats and subtle Rhodes chords giving way to strings, electric guitars and a bass solo.

    8. "She Knows" feat. Amber Coffman
    Cole once again struggles with monogamy and temptation on this standout cut. But here, as the album begins its journey toward higher ground, Cole's conscience may finally be winning out. "I'm passing up on bad hoes trying to be what she wants," he says, while a filtered-out melody from Amber Coffman of the Dirty Projectors floats above big, low piano octaves. Like on many songs on Justin Timberlake's "The 20/20 Experience" (there's that Timbaland influence again), the beat launches into a switched-up coda at the end, with the piano chords changing and Amber's singing blending with Cole's. You have to give it to J. Cole, for on almost every song, he puts in extra work to take the production beyond the usual looping rap track and transforms them into something bigger and more moving.

    9. "Rich Ni--az"
    Although "Born Sinner" is filled with stadium-sized beats, the album has intimate moments that shine as well. The stellar "Rich Ni--az" starts with a harp looping over the sound of running water, while Cole gives some of the most personal and relatable rhymes of the album, rapping about his mom moonlighting for money because his dad wasn't around. Cole's thoughts evolve constantly on the song: His middle finger to the titular "Rich Ni--az" turns into a tale of personal poverty and ultimately a comparison between his own bittersweet success and that of Basquiat or Kurt Cobain. In the end, it's something of a mission statement for Cole's career and his struggles throughout it: He wants success, but he doesn't want to sell his soul for it.

    10. "Where's Jermaine? (Skit) — 11. "Forbidden Fruit" feat. Kendrick Lamar
    After a skit featuring a choir rehearsal ("Where's Jermaine?"), Cole launches into another album highlight. "Forbidden Fruit" samples jazz organist Ronnie Foster's 1972 "Mystic Brew"—which any respectable hip-hop fan will recognize as the source material of A Tribe Called Quest's "Eclectic Relaxation" — but the drums give it a brand-new half-time bounce. Kendrick Lamar, the album's only rapper guest feature, shows up on the hook more singing than spitting. The song, a hip-hop take on Genesis, is yet another paean on the temptations of love and lust: "Me and my bitch / Took a little trip / Down to the garden / Took a little dip / Apple juice falling from her lips / Took a little sip." Can we get a remix with a Kendrick verse, please?

    12. "Chaining Day"
    "Chaining Day" is almost a spin-off of "Jesus Walks." Cole tackles another dichotomy, one of hip-hop's most well-known love-hate hypocrisies: the lavish Jesus pendant. "My last piece I swear, I even iced out Jesus hair," he spits, admitting he bought expensive jewelry and a car to keep up rap-game appearances but still doesn't own a house. The production is gorgeous, with a lush, soulful sample of bells and guitars reminiscent of Nas' "Memory Lane (Sittin' in Da Park)," interrupted by intermittent horn blasts.

    13. "Ain't That Some Shit (Interlude)"
    Like "Mo Money," this interlude stands on its own, with a banging beat that once again recalls Timbaland with chopped up, off-kilter strings and a double-time bounce. After an album full of moralizing and introspection, an amped-up Cole is in top-notch talk-smack form here: "Ain't that some shit? Well paid from this rapping shit."

    14. "Crooked Smile" feat. TLC
    Of all the early Kanye West influences on the album, this is probably the most blatant, and that's a good thing. The second single from the album updates "The College Dropout"'s chipmunk soul, with a sped-up vocal sample, bouncy piano chords and a choir. TLC's T-Boz and Chili drop an uplifting hook in between J. Cole's self-effacingly honest bars. It's easy to see this song becoming Cole's biggest pop hit yet.

    15. "Let Nas Down"
    Though this song had been kept under wraps till now, it's already been widely discussed, thanks to Hot 97 personality Peter Rosenberg talking about it on the air (and getting the title wrong, to Cole's public annoyance). Fortunately, the result lives up to the hype. While a bluesy sax melody loops in the background, Cole recounts his struggles coming up with a good single for his first album, "Cole World: The Sideline Story" — a struggle that eventually produced Cole's biggest hit to date, "Work Out." But Cole says he was crushed when he found out via No I.D. that one of his idols, Nas, didn't like the song. "You made 'You Owe Me,' dog, I thought you could relate," he tells Nas. Given rap's frequent chest-thumping, it's refreshing to see Cole talking about his own musical insecurities and his unabashed fandom of another rapper.

    16. "Born Sinner"
    "Born Sinner" concludes with its title track, which, perhaps due to the listening party's setting, sounded like the music that plays when a film's ending credits roll. Fittingly, it summarizes the moral balancing acts and dualities that center the LP. "This music shit is a gift, but God help us make it 'cause this music biz is a cliff," Cole warns, over a backdrop of blues chords and skittering drums. It may be the worst song on the album, but only because some of the disc's previous highlights shine so bright. The track, and album, end with another old-school Kanye flourish: an acapella choir and handclaps.

    Yes, nowadays Yeezy is onto the abrasive, high-art futurism of "New Slaves" and "Black Skinhead," but hearing Cole update his old trademarks so skillfully almost make you miss a Kanye that was aiming to please more than challenge.

    Almost every song on "Born Sinner" is better than those two from "Yeezus" (admittedly, full-length studio versions of "New Slaves" and Black Skinhead" haven't emerged yet). It seems inevitable that Kanye will win the sales showdown come June 18, but the excellence of "Born Sinner" makes the once unlikely-seeming possibility that Cole could win the more important contest — over listeners' ears — a lot more real."

  • MewLover34

    @Pauly D, No he's just overrated to you, that's how it works.

  • MewLover34

    @Pauly, how much of that is from the Billboard article? For a single person to say every song off Cole's album is better than the two we've heard off Ye's is straight up laughable. I wouldn't say there is a single song off that album better than New Slaves, and that is going completely off 1 live performance.

  • Joel

    so let me get this straight....I'm supposed to just say whether I like the album or not and nothing else??....shit I could just click the dope or nope button if I wanted to do that....the fuck is the point of having a comment section if you can't get into nuance??

    ya'll are ignorant

  • Pauly D

    @MewLover

    Here is the Dictionary (dot) com definition of the word "overrated"

    overrated[ oh-ver-reyt]
    verb (used with object) [o·ver·rat·ed, o·ver·rat·ing.]
    1.
    to rate or appraise too highly;

    With that definition, something being overrated has to be left up entirely up to the person and is subjective. If I don't like Schoolboy Q, that doesn't mean that I don't think he's undeserving of praise and doesn't have talent. It's just that I personally don't have a big taste for his music.

    Again, not liking something and something being "overrated" are greatly different, though on the surface it appears not to be

  • MewLover34

    "almost make you miss a Kanye that was aiming to please more than challenge"
    Not that I read all that bullshit, but this is the most pathetic thing I have heard on here all day. Who paid this person to write such a dick sucking review of an album that will certainly be considered a enormous disappointment as more time passes. Most of us are already there though.

  • Pauly D

    @MewLover

    In my opinion, New Slaves is the exact thing you DON'T want to do in music.

    1. Typical production laced with lazy horns and mediocre electronic sounds.

    2. Stale and contradictive content, seeing as Ye has tackled the subject of racism in America much more fluently on different tracks (Gorgeous, Murder To Excellence, Jesus Walks,etc), as well as his apparent stance in the first verse against materialism, when he has shown himself to be one of the most materialistic rappers.

    Black Skinhead takes what New Slaves SHOULD, COULD and WOULD have been and improves 20x over imo

  • Pauly D

    Why is it called "dick sucking" when someone gives an album good marks? That's a horrible way to try to get away from the fact that some people actually LOVE this album and opinions differ.

  • Pauly D

    And that's the problem with older Hip Hop fans in general. They don't embrace opinions or differences. It's either my opinion or nothing. My way or the high way. It's sickening, barbaric, horribly foolish and fucking stupid to put it blunty.

  • MewLover34

    If you don;t think that is an outrageously positive review, than I'm not sure you listened to the album. This man obviously has very very low standards for hip-hop. Marty's track review is pretty much spot on, this other one you posted? It is the DEFINITION of dick sucking, look it up, I'm pretty sure they updated the website with this review.

  • Pauly D

    Nigga, I've listened to the album. Been listening the entire day.

    Look, I could understand if you didn't like the album. That's fine, it's your opinion and you have the RIGHT to have it. But to call someone else's opinion the "definition" of dicksucking is disgusting.

    Intolerance and Ignorance go hand in hand with Hip Hop Heads apparently. Like I haven't known that for years now.

  • Pauly D

    Kid: Holy fuck, this new Action Bronson track is AMAZING

    Other nigga: Well it's not to ME, therefore you're dickriding this song too much, it's a 3.5/10 AT BEST. LEARN THAT MY OPINION IS THE ONLY OPINION.

    Fuckin scust

  • MewLover34

    "Although “Born Sinner” is filled with stadium-sized beats"
    The entire album is filled with very low key subtle production, how anyone could say this is "stadium-sized" production is beyond me. That's all I'm saying, this review is fucking ridicules and objectively wrong. I say he is on a payroll somewhere, but maybe he just really loves Cole, but it is not a legitimate review.

  • Pauly D

    not my opinion = not a legitimate review

    k.

  • Pauly D

    review[ ri-vyoo]
    noun
    1.
    a critical article or report, as in a periodical, on a book, play, recital, or the like; critique; evaluation.

    But that review DEFINITELY doesn't fit under this category :oblivious:

  • MewLover34

    Your not listening. "Stadium Sized Beats" There are no beats whatsoever like that on this album, that is nowhere in the vicinity of an opinion, it's just the way it is. Would you like me to go back up there and pick out some other foolish thing this guy said? Doubt it will take long.

  • Pauly D

    First: You probably HAVEN'T heard the CDQ version, so to judge whether something sounds "stadium sized" with a fucking 192 bit rate is fucking scust in itself.

    Second: Villuminati, She Knows, Power Trip, Trouble, Runaway, Crooked Smile, Born Sinner, Ain't That Some Shit, are all songs that have high amounts of bass.

    So yeah. There you go again. Going near-full retard

  • Read a book

    Album is dope as fuck. I think Cole fans will definitely be pleased. Definitely a day one purchase. Cole haters might not like it, but who gives a fuck. This a J Cole post.

  • Pauly D

    Hell, I doubt you've ever listened to this shit from a SYSTEM to tell if this shit has "Stadium sized beats".

    Hell, I beat you probably listened with laptop speakers or some bogus shit ha

  • duh

    Its not that i dont like cole, i thought his first album was pretty good, and i thought his mixtapes were great. Just because he doesnt wow you with lyracism and rhyme schemes doesnt mean that he cant make good music, because clearly he has. but the album in itself shouldve been better than what it was. He has a few standout tracks ( villematic, crooked smile, let nas down, born sinner) but you cant drop on the same day as kanye west, and have this album not be as good as your first one, or any body of music that dropped before this. Im not a cole hater , but this album just didn't highlight Cole's best attributes. So Pauly D.. you can get over it or get over it.

  • Pauly D

    @readabook

    hahah, I especially loved the throwback to Lil Cole!

  • MewLover34

    You do understand your doing the exact same thing your accusing me of doing right? I don't like the album, CDQ is not going to change the songs enough for them to sound good to me. This is just my opinion, but I'm a retard for having it. Makes sense. It's my OPINION that the review you saw fit to link was bullshit. Get over it...

  • Pauly D

    @duh

    Wow, another OPINION. You think it didn't highlight Cole's best attributes. I think it did. Who's gonna win this battle of OPINIONS?

    No one, because I could give two fucks and a quarter.

  • duh

    @ pauly D you must feel dumb right now lol

  • Westcoast

    Can't wait for the trap album of Yeesus to drop def downloading it, great album Cole congrats on putting a great album!

  • Pauly D

    Because you're already deadset on not liking them, of course you wouldn't even like the CDQ. But what you just said basically CONFIRMS that you CAN'T have an opinion on whether the album has stadium type beats or not, because you haven't listened to said production at it's fullest potential.

    Also this:

    “You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant.”

    Album doesn't have stadium style beats even though I haven't listened to the album in a proper setting = an informed opinion.

    Haha nope

  • duh

    im simply stating that you were wrong in your accusation that i didn't like cole. everything in the c section is an opinion its a music blog. lol every comment you made is an opinion, only thing in music where you be factual is just album sales, and no one has brought that up.

  • Pauly D

    lel for what breh?

  • j-iDontGivA

    @Damn Shame, you said Drake was Lebroning it. That's about the biggest joke in the world. Ya niggaz need to stop listening to the radio and think that that is the only barometer for dopeness and success.

    With so much hate in the comment section you would think it was the same 3 dudes hating and changing their user names. Cole's album is fire hands down. Villuminati, Forbidden Fruit, Trouble, Power Trip, Ain't That Some Shit, Land Of The Snakes, Let Nas Down are my favs after one listen. Comparing him to other artist is pointless when each artist has a different sound and team of beat makers. 7 hot songs on a commercially released album is dope especially when other artist like Kendrick had around the same amount. GKMC for me had 8 hot songs off the bat and that's including Backseat Freestyle which had to grow on me. And dudes trying to say Born Sinner is like GKMC is on crack bc if you heard the two albums you would know they have a very different sound and completely different subject matter as well. But again that's IF you heard them both.

  • Pauly D

    @duh

    Well damn. I guess you got me :kanyeshrug:

    But I don't agree with this though: "only thing in music where you be factual is just album sales"

    Hardly true. In terms of which artists and albums were innovative enough to change the game, that is completely objective

  • Pauly D

    Imho music in general is 85% subjective and 15% objective.

  • MewLover34

    Pauly, Happy you liked the album bro, hope you like Yeezus too.
    ^listens to Acid Rap to wash my brain of coles bullshit*

  • Joel

    constantly repeating that something is subjective and therefore any debate about said thing is pointless is not an effective way to build discussion...yea an opinion is subjective...no shit its tied up in the definition of the word...but if you don't agree that things can have aesthetic value and certain opinions have more value than others based on how refined their tastes are than what is the point of commenting at all...comment sections on sites like this are examples of people working shaping the cultural values of their society at the ground level...questioning of opinion should be encouraged..

  • Pauly D

    @MewLover

    hahah okay. I'm probably gonna like Yeezus a lot tbh. Black Skinhead and Awesome sound GREAT

  • For Damn Shame

    @j-iDon'tGiveA oh no...real hip hop hipster. Now if Drake's songs weren't dope he wouldn't be LeBron but something some ppl need to deal with...his shit is dope chart-wise and music-wise. I don't understand how that's a "joke" but okay..

    Btw niggas don't hate Cole. But people like you see people express they feelings that Cole hasn't made anything better than his mixtapes, y'all see that as hate. Naw son...oh yeah btw 7/16 is not good. Kendrick was 8/12 by your standards and Cole was 7/16 which means more than half of Sinner's songs arent dope in your opinion..so yeah. Rework your math.

  • Pauly D

    Differences in opinion are great as well. But you know what's NOT great? Effectively shitting on someone else's opinion because you don't agree with it. That's not a discussion; it's the beginnings of a rant (no real shots at Mew doe lol)

  • LOL66

    @mew, you got shit on your brains or should I say in them. Apparently you have to wash your brain because there's too much shit in it.

    I couldn't help it. -LOL66

  • Joel

    exactly...thats what I was trying to get across to Marty....dude was acting like he wanted to fight me and we were basically saying the same thing lol

  • al

    This was a good album, I enjoyed the 2Chainz album more though... I'm serious

  • MewLover34

    3 track in on Acid Rap and it's already better than Born Sinner. #JustSayin

  • Master Lee

    What site has the leak? Every site I go too doesn't work. I'm still going to cop the album on June 18th to support Cole. I just want to hear the album like everyone else.

  • j-iDontGivA

    @Dame shame, when did I say you couldn't express your feelings. If you got feelings I'll give you a minute so you can cry them out. Now, back to this shit comparing drake to Lebron. That is about the stupidest thing I ever read. Drake is a sole artist lebron's success is predicated off of a team. If you're comparing the Heat to drake's camp now where does that really put him. Come on son not as the leader. He's playing robin to lil waynes batman just like DWade is to Lebron. Lebron is the MVP of his league on the other end drake is not the MVP of hip hop. But you can keep trying to tell yourself that. And I don't like drake or wayne their shit is too pop candy coated.

    Looks like you can't read I said first as in 7 of Kendricks songs I like off the bat and the 8th grew on me but apparently you don't know how to identify a first opinion on the album. 7/16 vs 8/12 means shit when in basketball, the comparison you love to use, comes out to around the same score. However you get them is however you get them regardless of the average.

  • duh

    Wow probably the stupidest comment on this whole c section. Congrats j-idontgiva, congrats

  • For Damn Shame

    @j-iDontGivA Lmaoo..robin to wayne's batman? I mean the fact that Drake has kept YMCMB relevant since Wayne's prison bid and lack of talent after you can't seriously tell me Drake isn't the leader...lol and please don't do the Skip Bayless thing with LeBron. That's idiotic.

    Read your words carefully...
    "7/16 vs 8/12 means shit when in basketball, the comparison you love to use, comes out to around the same score. However you get them is however you get them regardless of the average."

    No..simply no. When a nigga shoot 8/12 it's called efficient (I want you to remember that word) and get's high praise for shot selection and w/e. When a nigga is 7/16 that's called non-efficient aka the nigga was just shooting. So for your "It comes out the same score" mindset, I want you to know that when Cole has 7 "dope" songs on an album outta 16, you're stating the other 9 aren't up to that level...aka not efficient. While 8/12 or my bad 7/12 (forgot it needs to "grow" on you first) would be over 50% aka efficient shooting. Yes 7 and 7 are the same numbers (Good Job!) but when you get to middle school you'll learn about these things called...PERCENTAGES.

  • For Damn Shame

    Btw..when Drake drops SFTB and goes platinum a month later that's MVP status.

  • Boom

    How about we all agree its better than Sideline Story?

  • For Damn Shame

    @Boom lol agreed.

  • http://N/A XI

    Since when is nearly 1/2 and 3/4 the same thing ?

  • http://N/A XI

    **less than 1/2

  • http://N/A XI

    *basically 3/4
    man, typing lessons are needed..

  • http://N/A XI

    I see what marty was saying about cole basically throwing jay under the bus.

    Aside from the disrespectful shit, though.

    1st joint is dooooooooooooooooope

  • marty mcfly

    And rapping about being broke before and now being rich is not a dope new concept either. That shit has been done on almost every mainstream hip hop album so just stop. The come up story rhymes are cool but Cole did that 100 times already before Born Sinner so him rapping about it now doesn't make some shit with deep substance. You know how much shit is really going on out there in the world and in the community today and this nigga wanna give you the simpleton raps? Wack

  • marty mcfly

    @Pauly D , and you copied some shit you read somewhere from an industry insider but newsflash, they cant say anything negative about Cole's music cause they worried about keeping relationships. I did my review about beats and rhymes, simple as that. I dont give a fuck about how people in the industry feel about this nigga's album. Overall it had alot more wack shit then dope shit so its fucking wack at the end of the day.

  • Boom

    At the end of the day, no matter how good an album is, you can't please everyone. Best believe people have hated on what others would consider classics (not sayin Born Sinner is a classic), so peoples opinions vary. How I feel..he took a couple steps back with Sideline story, and he has taken a step forward with this album. I guess some niggas were expecting him to make this giant ass leap, and make the best album ever. Some people can't be satisfied because of their lofty expectations. I believe he has moved forward, he has shown he is noteworthy rapper among the "new school" of artists. After a couple of listens I still can't say its his BEST work overall but the buzz is back about Cole, it may not be the buzz he had after Friday Night Lights, but this is progress. Lets see if it can continue.

  • Antonio D.

    Put the song in the context of man's adaption to the ever-changing stimulus in the world. J. cole is a prophet, guiding us in a world that is still as dangerous, maybe more, when adam and eve (metaphor for our homo-sapien ancestors) were walking this world. J. cole is merely giving us an objective avenue that we are each interpreting in our own subjective point of view. Most of ya'll are merely looking at the surface meaning of the song and not at the deep psycho-socio meaning of the song. y'all forget that COLE is an EDUCATED human being with a conscious that supersedes that of normal kid on the block.

  • j-iDontGivA

    @dame shame, Oh I get it you're a drake dicksucker, well every artist needs them I guess. My fault your whole logic is based off of the fact that you idolize him. MVP status he does not make but as I said that's funny that you think comparing him to lebron does. Here we go again another cat on here posting 2 comments to my 1.
    If we go off of what your logic is drake's last album had 18 songs and I didn't like any of them so what does that make him a 0/18. That's a brick. So Kendrick had in my opinion 8/12 when it's all said and done and right now J Cole has 7/16. Again your logic not mine. So how does it go my considering a songs is dope to the actual albums song tracklist, right. Whereas mine was how many songs I considered dope never once caring about how many songs were on the album. Comparing of course second album releases. When you try to base your logic off of my opinion you come out looking quite stupid. What's drake's percentage now again? Trying to turn around my opinion to feed into your idiotic logic is ridiculous.
    Even if you were to say hits to album song ratio(wow, middle school must be growing on me) he's still way below 50 (wait for it) percent.

  • For Damn Shame

    @j-iDontGivA as you stated before, you don't like Drake so laughing at your response was short-lived but besides your obvious "real hip-hop non pop" mind (even though you probably no nothing but mainstream rappers, ironically) as someone after me stated:

    "Wow probably the stupidest comment on this whole c section. Congrats j-idontgiva, congrats"

    It's obvious your brain still can't compute that 7/16 is not good. Btw it wasn't my logic as I never used those numbers before you but it's okay...slow people often forget the stuff they do. Because my "logic" was Cole didn't deliver...yours was to state 7/16 songs=nice. But as I stated before, "my logic" (but in reality you made it up) showed that even when you tried to defend Cole, you ended up failing...btw it's okay to not like Drake as most "hip-hop heads" don't but maybe when you reach 16 you'll begin to notice hip hop is more than just "tha underground" it's a worldwide mass culture.

  • Truth Hurts

    Wow.. niggas posting 1000 word essays n shit trying to convince people that Cole's mediocre album is a classic or something.. SMH.

  • nelo

    "tears for odb/drug-induced poetry"

    Lest we lose sight of it, the album is bbullshit...crappy. Those who are in its defense, at best,wud give an 'aiight'. "maybe after a second listen or third or fourth". Like really where do get off.
    U fags are the reason y lil Dwayne is still selling. U Dick pullers! If u keep approving such crappy raps, u encouraging Jermaine to go down just like Wayne. I like cole,. But I'm afraid he lost his touch on this one. How did hov let this rich the masses.
    He might cum back strongly on his next project, but mos def not this one. By the way that's a punchline for ya ass

  • j-iDontGivA

    @dame shame, Wow dude more of this Drake dick riding shit. Trying to justify your ill gotten logic is retarded. Do you read? Where in my first statement did I write 7/16? I wrote 7 dope songs on an album to me is hot and you came with this 7/16 shit trying to again justify why you think it's bad by comparing him to the songs I like on Kendrick's GKMC and his total album songs. "slow people often forget the stuff they do" your very own comment is quite apropos. Do you know what that word means? Even if you try to go with your stupid logic 4 of them songs on Cole's album is skits or interludes so you again have to reevaluate your logic so what that make it 7/12, count the interludes cause nigga is spitting on them and it's 7/14. Get the fuck out of here. You a really funny cat backing off what you wrote. My first comment also stated that comparing him to another artist was pointless but that probably went over your head. Last time I checked the dope to nope ratio on any of J Cole post here the dopes heavily out way the nopes. What's that percentage like. Your in the minority but like a lot of hater cats running your mouth on these comment boards. I like 8 songs now, She Knows grew on me. Apparently you're trying to dictate what I and close to 1,000 other people find interesting. That's OK keep trying. As I said you could hate and catch those feelings all you want but I know that hate has an ulterior motive. In your case it's your undying love for drake in others on this board it's kanye. That's cool like I wrote these comment boards probably have 3 hating cats changing there names but coming with the same tried lines.
    Oh and for that cat saying niggaz posting 1,000 word essays trying to defend Cole it's actually the other way around.

  • marty mcfly

    Personally Im not commenting on Cole's album as an attempt to show some kinda support for Kanye. My opinion is just about the music on this album period and really this album should've been called Songs About Girls or Girls Girls Girls - The Money and Hoes Story. This album is not dark, it is not complex and it is not an album thats about the seven deadly sins or any kinda religious concept like that. Bizzle's The Good Fight album is so much better then Born Sinner in that regard (especially lyrically). What Cole's album is is a bunch of songs put together over some familiar samples here and there with abcish type lyricism and commercialized hooks and themes thats been extremely watered down for females and little girls to listen. There's like 2 songs on here for hardcore hip hop heads and the rest is cliche formulaic mainstream cotton candy sugar sweet junk food music.

  • gregory kruxx.

    @Praises Rza summed it up best. I agree... But this dude @marty mcfly is way too sensitive about quote on quote real hip hop all the time..
    Since you mentioned Girls Girls Girls a s a title and commercialized hooks Im sure you probably felt the same about The Blueprint when it dropped. commercial hooks. simple lyrics...(And Im not comparing blueprint to born sinner so dont put words in my mouth) BUT
    Man. Cole wrote what he wanted to write about. If Marvin Gaye came back from the dead you gona tell him writing about girls wasnt a good look. Or let me guess we cant do this in Hip Hop cause I know lyrics and wordplay and blah blah blah.....WTF is this dude talking about...
    The album is solid. maybe not the making of a classic but a solid effort. Shit that TLC shit was the truth reminds me of some shit from the 90s that would have been bumping through the streets of Queens.At the end of the day Marty its not about pleasing hardcore hip hop heads all the time (I am one by the way) its about delivering what he wanted to. Remember hes the artist he makes his art the way he wants t whether you or me like it or not..smh...lol...some niggahs

  • ??

    This ain't no GKMC, niggas have nerve to even dare to compare him to Kendrick. At the end of the day, Cole is an average MC.. yeah he showed flashes of potential greatness on his early mixtapes; fans were so starved for anyone with a semblance of lyrical ability they over hyped him to the moon. Once Kanye drops, this album will be forgotten..

  • marty mcfly

    @gregpory kruxx, please dont mention the Blueprint album and Born Sinner as if there on a similar level because you know there not. Blueprint was exciting, this album is boring. Jayz has bars and range in subject matter, Cole sounded like he took The Dreams Love vs Money album and said let me make a rap version of this. Kanye and Just Blaze made better beats then Cole too. People talking about this album is "solid" but solid what? Solid full of dopeness or solid full of mediocre shit with some wack shit in there too. Like "solid" meaning what? There's alot of songs? Ok, whooty doo. If Drake made this album you would say its the softest shit all year but since Cole made it then its "solid". You also think of yourself as a hardcore hip hop head, ok well then it sounds like to me your lowering your standards for this cat. Is there a problem with making songs about girls? NO but when you claim to be a lyricist and you know for a fact that people compare you to Nas and people look at you as a hardcore MC, you can make songs about bitches but dont create a whole album about bitches because I dont think that has ever been dope to any hardcore hip hop fans ever at any time period. Also look at the album, dude is bashing himself. He talks about selling out in the very first song (hence why he's like promising the fans he'll never let his soul go again), he goes through out the album talking about how he's money crazy, chain buy crazy and always on some how many bitches can I fuck with mentality and then at the end he straight up tells you he has let Nas down. Now some will say thats cool he's just being honest but some would say well if he had all those problems then what kinda artist is he? Is he really making records for hip hop heads or not? Anyway this album just aint the dope and its not the fire. Hip hop has never given points for being average or below average or mediocre or simply "solid" The fans are here for straight up undeniable dope shit top to bottom period end of story and you know it. Im not gonna lower my standards for Cole or any MC in the culture period.

  • Joel

    @Marty...

    sigh...if I could post a picture of a little dude shaking his head in frustration right now I would....he never said Born Sinner and The Blueprint were on the same level across the board....he even added a caveat in parentheses saying as much and you went ahead and did it anyway lol...he's saying the subject matter was similar and not very diverse

    my god you're on full witch hunt mode now bro...I can't even take you seriously

  • marty mcfly

    @ Joel, I wrote three sentences about that issue of Blueprint and Born Sinner but then I talked about other things so you might wanna read the rest but what subject matter on Born Sinner is similar to whats on Blueprint? Girls? Thats about it and regardless of subject matter (which are NOT very similar between the albums) Blueprint was just a better album, I know it and you know it. YOU yourself has said that you think the album is a disappointment and YOU said yourself that your "basically in FULL agreement" with me on this album. Why dont defend an album that you view as a disappointment and dont agree with me and then defend the album because there is no defending from me going on. I went track for track and honestly in listening for the 2nd time, I went bar for bar so when I say the album really aint dope, im not just saying anything fool and again YOU yourself as already claimed to agree with my opinion. Dont play both sides and I dont wanna shit about it being "solid" or average or mediocre. I wanna hear from somebody who thinks this album is incredible. I wanna hear from somebody who thinks this album has thee best lyrics and the best beats period. Let them explain why cause if people like you are claiming to agree with me then its no need for you to comment to me. And again nobody wants to here about being average or compared to whoever or whatever. People want greatness bar for bar and beat for beat. I know it and you know it and if Cole is that nigga then explain to me why this album is that of greatness. Anything less is no longer worth discussion cause if you this happy of mediocre shit then fine but dont base an argument or debate on it.

  • marty mcfly

    And if you "disappointed" then its no need to defend the album because disappointment is not a good thing. I know people can be disappointed and still see some good in a project but still, you were disappointed for a reason. I'll say Villuminati and Let Nas Down are dope and worthy of being album songs but the rest of that shit was weak, cookie cutter, BELOW average, watered down, soft sounding, boring, uninspiring, redundant, bullshit. SOME of the production was ok but overall it was sleepy and overall the shit had more wackness then dopeness. PERIOD. Is there a single person out there (besides Pauly D cause he's a Cole stan), who thinks this album is INCREDIBLE (or any other word like such)? I thought so

  • Joel

    I thought the album was above average...I am somewhat disappointed overall because I was expecting more...the only two tracks that I would call watered down garbage are trouble and chaining day...otherwise I'm satisfied but not blown away....and I was expecting to be blown away, what with all the hype and 6 month pushback on the release....im defending the album because you seem to hold the opinion that it is garbage and I disagree

    the album stream is on here now though so if you'd like to continue the discussion move over there

  • ColeWorld

    Cole was doing skits before Kendrick...

  • marty mcfly

    People aren't disappointed by albums thats ABOVE average because above average would mean you the albums DOPE. If you disappoint OVERALL, then that doesn't mean above average or even average, thats leaning on that below average shit. There so much watered down material on this shit that your only hearing two songs is crazy. The little jingles and simple wording on this album is the pure definition of "watered down" and again disappointment overall does not mean above average in any way shape or form.

  • ….

    First of all, ever since Born Sinner was streamed & eventually leaked, all I've been reading is a plethora of mixed reviews. As expected, the stans & the haters came to play and KTT has turned into a **** storm of ignorance exceeding from both sides. Most of the stans praise this album with the obscure reasoning while the haters hate just as poorly, if not worse. I ask you all, how the hell do you listen to something once & proceed to judge it critically? Something like that is the stupidest **** a so called "fan of music" can do. Not only do you disrespect the artist, but you disrespect yourself. Get your **** together KTT. Now that's that done, let me proceed to explain to you the concept behind this beautiful body of work that most of you somehow seem to miss.

    To of all of you that really think that all Cole is rapping about is women & his life's stuggle, k!ll yourselves. [pic][pic]Before this album started to build hype, Cole through a **** ton extra for good reason. He thoroughly explained that Power Trip isn't your average single. The concept behind Power Trip follows through in all of Born Sinner. The supposed woman that he's talking about is the rap game or Hip-Hop in it's essence. The "Power Trip" is his ascent to the Billboards and pop music from the tragedy that was Work Out. Cole explains this from the very beginning of the album with Villuminati and to end with the Born Sinner title track. There's a reason why the chorus of the last song transitions into the intro. It represents Cole's rebirth.

    "My nicca...I ain't ever letting go. I ain't ever letting you go again" - This line refers to his soul & how he gave it away to sell records. Essentially, it also segments into the rest of the story. The dark tone behind the production explains his anger towards the ignorant[..] fans that claimed he sold his soul and also represents the beginning of the dark path he took for his power trip. The Kerney Sermon skit is simple in that it represents the trickery he fell for and that's how he ended up in LA or the LAnd of the Snakes. Here he meets the chick that he thinks he doesn't have to commit to and can **** at any time (Pop/Fame). He explains his fun, but along the line he meets back up with his old chick (Hip-Hop/True Love) and she tells him he ain't **** cause he left her for a stupid, insignificant broad...Hence, the next song is Power Trip which should be self-explanatory.

    Mo Money is an interlude for a reason. Cole takes a break from the story and gets into social commentary by way of the experience he's gained by being around Hov & the rich white men that gave life the dumb, lusty broad being fame. This point shows up again later in the album. Just listen to the damn song and it'll begin to make sense. In the next song Trouble, he's taking about the bad **** again & why he's even back staring in her direction. "She like 'Don't you know this **** already? nicca, ain't you rich already?' Yeah, but I got dumb as ****. Hanging 'round these rappers cause they dumb as ****." - This refers to how strong the lust is and why he's considering ****ing her again and it's because making those dumb as records really does make you sell & feel good. But he catches himself, as he know this is ain't the right choice by his gut. Had a nicca's baby, little man don’t know. Mama, was a freak, got it in on the low. 12 years later when my song come on, he ask "Mama, did you **** J. Cole?" - The little mans is the future generation and the song is Work Out. The rest of the story in the song should make more sense after realizing this.

    The skit for Runaway is a metaphor to Cole and his relationship to Hip-Hop and then the other ****es as fame. When he alone, he vibes with it like no other. But when he's around his friends, he loses his composure cause what's poppin at that moment is being popular and getting ****es. He starts off further explaining his relationship with Hip-Hop but then...Oh ****, goddamn, I think the devil got his hands on me
    Stripper saying: "Baby, why don't you throw these bands on me?" And I came to spend, she pop a molly let the mother****ing games begin
    I'm running... - Clever references to Juicy J's song & Trinidad James' song in that it's hard to ignore the success that those songs had & he doesn't wanna lose that chance. He's in trouble cause it's a hard choice to make. He's holding on desperately to his wife at home though...the wife that's been waiting for 10 yrs....It's arguable, but Hip-Hop hasn't been the same since 03-04'. That's Cole reference to his wife's "wait."
    In the 3rd verse he gets back to the social commentary briefly and further explains the root of the lusty **** and how the white man created her just to tease the black man and essentially becoming a slave again by slaving away trying to make hit songs that eventually bring more money back to the white man which explains... - "Rich white man rule the nation still, only difference is we all slaves now. The chains still concealed in our thoughts.If I follow my heart to save myself, could I run away from 50 mill like Dave Chappelle?" She Knows is a song talking about the Hip-Hop chick..should be self-explanatory by now.

    There ya'll go. I gave ya'll the first half of the album...the "dark" side Cole has been referring to this whole time. Forbidden Fruit is where the shift takes place to the "light" or "good" and his move back into positivity. The rest of the album should follow through and make sense from here. Just stay in that mind set. I'm tired, but mostly tired of trying to explain this to most of ya'll who won't care. It won't matter cause Cole already won. He made a great album and young[..] ignants from KTT won't affect the ultimate critical acclaim he'll receive. Eventually, ya'll haters will jump back on the bandwagon one way or another. If not in public, it will be in private. You can deny the heat that Cole served this summer.
    Clap for em'

    J. Cole Explains The Concepts Of Born Sinner In Detail At Harvard - youtube

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